TRANSCRIPT OF ABC RADIO 774 INTERVIEW WITH DEREK GUILLE Tuesday, July 6, 2004 Music: "P.S. I Love You" by the Beatles Derek P.S. I Love You. Sally McLean has written and directed a new play called "PS I Love You". it focusses on the home front in Melbourne during 1942, during World war Two. It particularly focusses on women and women's roles in the auxiliary services at the time. Sally good evening, welcome to the program. Sally Good evening Derek, lovely to be here. Derek I'm so pleased you could join us. I'm intrigued by ps I love you. what's the background to this story? How did you come to write it? Sally Well essentially, I guess, our family, as I discovered through trawling through the old family history archives, have been very military based, since probably the 1700's. But we actually discovered that my Great uncle, Uncle Frank Dolphin was on Kododa, and sadly lost on Kokoda. And so, I've read all his letters that he'd sent home from the front, and his photo was always on display in my grandparent's house. And my grandmother was very much still in the mode of the depression and World War 2, where we still had dripping in a container by the oven and that sort of thing. Derek Oh. Sally Ooo. Exactly! Derek No, no I'm remembering. It wasn't that long ago that we stopped having dripping. I used to love toast and dripping for breakfast. Sally Oh well, yes, I suppose, yes that's true, but as a seven year old, when you didn't have to have dripping, it was like "eew, really?". Derek Eew, yuck, yes. Sally And you used to get told "well we had to have this all the way through the second world war - don't you complain - we survived"! But it was that influence of the family, and then there was a friend of the family, Doris Carter, who has sadly passed away now, but she was a Wing Officer in the WAAAF, and I actually never knew about her war service, sadly, 'till after she died. But she worked in intelligence as it turned out, so we understand, and that got me really interested in women's roles in the War, because I always had the impression women sat home knitting socks and putting care packages together, and of course they didn't - they did so much more and took on so much of an active role in Australian society while the War was taking place, because we needed so many of our men to fight. And so all the auxiliary services, I discovered, were heavily populated by the female population. They were all signing up and serving - in the WAAAF, in the WRANS, in the Army, in the Land Army, which sadly wasn't acknowledged as an actual armed service as such, but all the girls volunteered to go out and work on the farms - keep all the produce coming - and there were several other versions of service, such as Cheer Up Girls, and all sorts of different roles these women played. Derek What I find interesting about PS I Love You is the fact that in the last decade or so we've actually heard more about the Women's Land Army and the roles the women played there on farms as you say and doing the work that men had previously done to ensure that there was a supply of food, that production kept turning over, but we haven't heard much, and there's not been a particular focus women in the metropolitan area - women doing jobs on the Home Front. Sally Exactly. I was amazed. I mean for the first time this year I went to the ANZAC memorial service at the Shrine, on ANZAC Day - the Dawn Service - which I'd always intended to go to and had never managed to do. And I finally got there and it was meeting a couple of women who had actually served in the Australian Women's Army - I didn't even know we had an Army of women then! I didn't even realise that women had been signing up for this auxiliary service! And one of them had been a Gunner, which I was completely amazing to me, because they were being trained to use artillery and anti-aircraft guns - Derek Yes - Sally - from the tops of buildings, and on the coastline. And that was a revelation to me because now we have this thing about women not having active service, but then we were having them man these, well, these weapons to protect Australia from invasion. And I found that absolutey fascinating and got talking to her. And I guess also that whole thing of finally being there, amongst all these people who had served, who had come to remember those who hadn't survived and hadn't come back, or those who had sadly passed in the years gone by, it really brought it tangibly home to me that Melbourne as a city had actually gone through a really tough time itself through that War. I mean, essentially, we were behaving - we had rations, we had the ration cards, we had sandbags on all the major buildings, we had guns on the roofs, we had Air Raid practice, we did all of that, and, of course, fortunately we weren't bombed , but we were preparing as if we were going to be. And the fear level at the time was exceptionally high, so, we really were a nation that was preparing, for the first time I think in Australia's history, in, you know, European history, we were preparing to be invaded. And that's quite an amazing thing to realise - that we weren't that remote, really, from what was going on. It was only happening off the coast of Queensland and up near Darwin. We were very close to being in trouble. Derek Well, that's right. We remember the various artillery placements put around at the time of the Crimean, and things like that, when we thought the Russians were coming, but it was never anywhere near as near, either overtly or covertly, as the Japanese threat to Australia was. Sally No, exactly. Because they were in Indonesia, they were so close to us, and in New Guinea and they were all coming through all these countries that were far too close for comfort. And I've been reading intelligence reports from 1942 and you could see that the people in control were a little nervous as well! I mean they had all sorts of plans and contingencies on how to cope with an invasion, should it come to that, and they fed the population with a lot of propaganda, obviously, to keep them working and to keep everyone working as a unit, so that we would be ready, should it happen. And speaking to people who were there at the time, they were saying it was a great party atmosphere, but it was almost "Party - because tomorrow we may not be here". Derek Well thank goodness you've been gathering these stories before they've all disappeared - that's the one thing - but how do you take this very big canvas that we've just discussing and put it on the stage? What's the focus of the play? How does it work? Sally Well I ended up ... ah ... because, as you say, there are a lot of stories and I obviously haven't been able to incorporate every single one, as much as I'd love to, so we brought it all down to ten different characters - essentially two households. We have one that's four girls living in a rooming house together - one's in the WAAAF, one's in the WRANS, another works in the Army and the fourth one isn't serving as such, but she's a Cheer Up Girl - which are the girls who used to go out to all the dances and be dance partners for all the soldiers on leave and sing at various concerts and all that sort of thing. And they also used to hand out cigarettes and talk to the soliders that had come back injured. So she does that - that's her War service. Then the other household is made up of a father and a daughter, and the son is fighting on Kokoda and the father's sister is a nurse who was serving in Singapore. And the nurse character is actually in the play and she becomes a Prisoner of War. So, we get her side of being a female in a Prisoner of War camp, which I know has been done before, but I felt a need to address the fact that women were on the War Front as well - Derek Yes - Sally - during that War. And we then have a RAAF pilot, who is based in Plymouth, part of the 10th Squadron, who were initially shipped out to pick up some new Sutherlands, "flying boats" in mid-'39 I think it was - and they were there when War was declared, so the Australian Government told them to stay there. So we have one pilot who is out there with his squadron, who hasn't come home yet - been out there for three years. And then, I have a Guerka in the story as well, because I have a Nepalese actor down here and I wrote the role for him because I think the Guerka's aren't covered very much and we don't know much about them and they did fight with the Australians on a lot of the battlefields and battle arenas. Derek Well, that's right. Fought alongside with the British and Australian Forces - that's correct. Sally, Judith has joined us. Judith, you were in the Land Army, were you Judith? Judith Auxiliary. Derek Auxiliary Land Army? Judith Not the main one. Derek Yes Judith We worked 'round various properties. And we got a badge and a pair of overalls. Derek And set to work. Judith That's right. Derek You were in Tasmania, Judith? Judith I was then, yes. Derek And you worked around, what, all of Tassie? Judith No, all round the properties in our area. And my father wouldn't sign the papers for me to join the main Land Army, 'cause he said "Oh, you'll be carting all those milk cartons on the Northwest Coast." And I tell you what, I lifted sheep and did all sorts of things. And we drove tractors and nobody will accept us. Derek And I guess that's the point Sally's making, isn't it, that there was all that service that was done, and it's not service that's recognised in the same way that the other forms of service that were necessary during the Wars has been recognised. And continues to be recognised with the new Service medal that's been announced. Judith And we drove stock to saleyards. And cattle and sheep - for miles. Derek Judith, do you have fond memories of it? Judith Yes, I do. It was great. I was about 17, 18 then. And my father wouldn't sign the papers for me to join the Land Army as such. Derek The full Land Army, yes. Judith Yes. But we don't get any recognition and we've been trying for years. Derek And it's recognition that is so deserved, too. Judith thanks for calling in. Sally, I'm glad Judith rang in, because you, in fact, are still after people's stories and, well, all sorts of aspects of women on the Home Front, aren't you? Sally Oh, absolutely. And regarding Judith and her Land Army work - we do have a Land Army character as well, and I'm very aware that those girls were not officially recognised and it's a great shame they weren't. 'Cause the saying goes "An army marches on it's stomach" - well, if these girls hadn't been producing the produce, the country would have fallen apart! Derek That's right! Not only the army, but everybody. Sally Exactly! So, I think it is something long overdue. There have been rumours that they are looking at acknowledging these girls finally. I mean, I don't know for certain, but I sincerely hope that's true, because they did an amazing amount of work, and probably more than people realise. As Judith was saying - lugging sheep around and driving trucks! It was hard manual labour and they did an incredible job. But yes, I am looking for stories. After writing the play, and it's set primarily in May of 1942, that specific month, for many reasons, but mainly because we had The Battle of the Coral Sea, which was the first time we had a major land and, ah, air and sea battle occur near Australia with the Japanese, but also the Brown Out Murders were going on at the time. Derek Same time, that's right. Sally Which was the strangling of women in Melbourne in the Brown Outs. Which sadly, turned out to be an American G.I. that was responsible. So there's that whole thing of women who were out there being independent, probably for the first time Australia's European history, women were out there actually "doing their bit" and were actually able to step outside the house - and all of a sudden someone starts murdering them halfway through the War. It put a great deal of extra fear on the Melbourne population particularly. My Nana lived a block away from where the first body was discovered and she said at the time she was terrified, as all women were, as this was the first time in the history of Australia that we had a serial killer. Which is what he was. So no-one really understood the psychology of these acts either. I guess what I'm looking for are stories from people who lived through that time. Or people who's parents lived through it and may have talked about it, who may have passed on the information. Because we want to involve the community. It's something that I personally wasn't aware of - how wartime affected Melbourne. I hadn't ever really looked at it. And it's a fascinating piece of history for this city that hasn't really been covered on stage. And I would love to hear from those people who were there. Because we want to do a big display in the foyer of the venue of all these stories. And any images or photos people might be happy for us to reproduce to put up there as well. Derek And with intentions of having a website and all those sorts of things too. Sally Yes, we have a website for the play already and we're building a seperate section, which, at this point, is tentatively called - "The Way We Were" and it's about the people who were there. And to have that then as an online testimonial and record of these people's experiences. So that everyone, around the world, if they wish, can actually tap in and have a look at it. Derek So, how do people actually get in touch with you - and I should mention that the premier is the 31st of July - Sally Yes. Derek So how do people find out more about participating and contributing? Sally And getting tickets! Derek Yes, and getting tickets! Sally The best thing to do ... we've got our website which is www.salmac.com/loveyou/ and the other way to contact me is through the phone number 0410 798 514. Derek So that's www.salmac.com/loveyou or 0410 798 514. The Premier's the 31st of July and what's the venue you're using? Sally We're using Mt Martha House in Mt Martha, which actually was appropriated by the Army during the Second World War, and it served as a RAAF base, and also as an R & R location for the American soldiers, so it, itself, is tied up with the story as well, which is a kind of nice piece of syncronicity. Derek Well, we'll keep in touch and we'll keep letting people know that they can contribute to this play and the expansions of it through the web and so forth. Thank you so much for being with us tonight, Sally, I do appreciate it. Sally That's alright Derek - thank you! Derek Sally McLean, writer and director of "PS I Love You". You'll be able to contact Sally through our web page as well because Jeremy has been putting the links up as we speak. It's seven to eight on 774 ABC Melbourne and ABC Victoria. < back to Press